ellegabrielle

Christian Advice about Modesty

12 posts in this topic

Hello again beautiful people!  ^_^ 

 

This is another post I make on christian advices that I've been led to share and maybe someone, somewhere will find it helpful.

 

First off I want to say that I mean to share it not only as a one-way post, but that I hope those of you who would be interested, would in turn share your opinion about it and maybe start a talk/debate around here.

 

So, this is a relatively short (1 h) documentary about the topic of modesty through attitude with an emphasis on clothing. They say modesty start from the closet/outside look. Altough I believe modesty comes from the heart, I do agree that you cannot be a truly modest person (aka here, not tempting others) and at the same time wear immodest clothing and vice-versa. In the end, your attitude or your clothing will speak and maybe attract undesired attention in your life.

 

I also want to point something out and this is that although they're not my own christian advices (and I do not feel in a position to give such now) I do share that they have helped me in my better understanding of the relatively new chosen path of living a christian life. I think for some of you they may seem to be coming from a too strict and conservative point of view ( as in "thou shall not" type) but I also find it necessary in today's world. And the documentary is far from being like that or boring; I highly enjoyed it, found it sincere, necessary and even funny at times. To me they come as an unexpected breath of fresh air because from all of a sudden, setting healthy and godly boundaries is in turn making me a lot more free in my life - something I never would of thought of happening a few years ago.

 

With this said, I hope this will not open topics about religion ( spoiler: it is made by catholic believers) and that the message will speak beyond these man-made walls. 

 

*** Special message: between the minutes of 15-16:30, there is a special testimony from a young woman that points exactly to the focus of the WTMCommunity - self-worth and finding the right one to marry. I encourage you to watch it.

 

God bless you all!

 

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But Feminism states men must be taught not to rape and that it's the man's problem if he is lusting after a woman for the way she dresses.

 

What about women with abnormally voluptous body shapes where their curves are all over the place even if they cover up?

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Ohhhh!! Thank you so much for sharing Gabi !!!

I had already seen this video and I enjoyed it !

 

It's a good reminder !

 

Thank you my sister :D  :)

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But Feminism states men must be taught not to rape and that it's the man's problem if he is lusting after a woman for the way she dresses.

 

What about women with abnormally voluptous body shapes where their curves are all over the place even if they cover up?

 

Ringer, what do you exactly mean by your statement? I don't exactly understand your motivation behind it. I will take what you posted in an ironic way, since most christians do not agree with feminism. I'm not a feminist but yes I do agree that men or women, should NOT RAPE, thank you. No matter the level of temptation. If a person does this to another person, it's his/her fault not the victims. I do NOT find dressing inappropriately an excuse for crime. How a person chooses to react to what is happening around is his/her responsibility. Yet it takes some level of maturity not to blame everyone else for your mistakes and assume your own actions. (addressed in a general way)

 

The doc. was a statement of teaching people (not only women) to dress in a decent way, as to HELP as much as possible another person not to be tempted. But the actions of that person are completely his/hers to be judged for. 

 

About your last statement; any person no matter the size or shape can find suitable, decent clothing if they so choose to. If there's a will, there's always a way.

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Ohhhh!! Thank you so much for sharing Gabi !!!

I had already seen this video and I enjoyed it !

 

It's a good reminder !

 

Thank you my sister :D  :)

 

You're welcome Gege! Glad you enjoyed it! :D

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I don't think Ringer is agreeing with his statement about what some feminists say about women's dress code and rape. I think he is simply being indignant towards that that point of view because he doesn't believe that himself. But that's not really the issue here.

 

Anyways, this is a great video. You're absolutely right when you say modesty begins from the heart. That inner modesty then flows out to our outer lifestyle. Interestingly enough, whenever the Bible talks about modesty, it is almost always in the context of behavioral conduct of a godly lifestyle. Very little of it addresses how to dress, although that is still somewhat important.  1 Peter 3:3-4 for example, talks about how true beauty doesn't consist of outward appearances but by a gentle and quiet spirit. Modesty is ultimately about having a humble heart before God and dress code is only a small part of it.

 

There are some problems with the modesty issue in the church today. First, it is usually reduced to an issue of clothing and it is always exclusivity a women's issue. Both men and women are called to have a modest spirit and men should also dress modestly as well. I can't tell you how disgusted I am seeing guys post shirtless pics from the bathroom online or walking around with baggy pants sagging on their butts. The worst offense of them all in my opinion is guys wearing skinny jeans. We all know that is equally sinful as murder. Who on earth decided it was fashionable or good for reproduction for men to wear his girlfriend's jeans? Nobody wants to see his big (or small) bulge in public. I'm sure God would facepalm himself at that. smh. 

 

Yes we should dress appropriately in a way that reflects our modesty. But the problem is sometimes we become legalistic about it. The trivial questions always come up. Is strapless shirts okay or not? Is this skirt showing too much leg? Ultimately these questions don't really mean much because what is modest is different depending on culture and occasion. You also cannot have every base covered (pun intended). You may have your breasts, butt and legs covered, but what about guys who have foot fetishes and you're wearing flip flops? Or what about guys who dress sharp but are showing huge biceps that cause women who love muscles to lust? The point is, you could completely covered like a Muslim woman and still people could lust after you. What is ultimately important is do you have a godly mindset? If you do, then you will naturally make an effort to dress modestly in your own way. That is all you can do. 

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Ringer, what do you exactly mean by your statement? I don't exactly understand your motivation behind it. I will take what you posted in an ironic way, since most christians do not agree with feminism. I'm not a feminist but yes I do agree that men or women, should NOT RAPE, thank you. No matter the level of temptation. If a person does this to another person, it's his/her fault not the victims. I do NOT find dressing inappropriately an excuse for crime. How a person chooses to react to what is happening around is his/her responsibility. Yet it takes some level of maturity not to blame everyone else for your mistakes and assume your own actions. (addressed in a general way)

 

The doc. was a statement of teaching people (not only women) to dress in a decent way, as to HELP as much as possible another person not to be tempted. But the actions of that person are completely his/hers to be judged for. 

 

About your last statement; any person no matter the size or shape can find suitable, decent clothing if they so choose to. If there's a will, there's always a way.

What Invincible said is correct.

I was posting something that I've seen feminists state, kind of as a bug spray.

 

Anyway, I do believe modest dress is the best dress. Sorry if I came off the wrong way.

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I'm a Christian, and I have a lot of thoughts on this subject, but I'll try to keep this brief. I watched the first 10 or so minutes of the video and found it difficult to stomach in places, especially when teenage boys are presented as experts about how men behave and how women should behave.

 

I always get uncomfortable when we Christians discuss modesty. As Invincible said, the conversation tends to revolve around women's behavior. We seem to blame women for what they cannot control (the sexual attraction of men) and fail to hold men accountable for what they can control.

 

I know that our clothing can reflect our spiritual condition (much like our spiritual condition is reflected in our finances, our attitude to work, our friendships, our leisure and hobbies, etc.). I know that the Christian life is lived in community and that we are called to love, support, and encourage each other. But this is one issue where I believe that our teaching has placed an unfair burden of shame on women.

 

I'll also admit to some conflicted feelings on this topic. I don't mean to imply that I believe modesty is unimportant or that I have no respect for the perspectives presented in the video. Nor would I ever want to offend any of you other posters. I humbly submit my misgivings to a community I value.

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I don't think Ringer is agreeing with his statement about what some feminists say about women's dress code and rape. I think he is simply being indignant towards that that point of view because he doesn't believe that himself. But that's not really the issue here.

 

Anyways, this is a great video. You're absolutely right when you say modesty begins from the heart. That inner modesty then flows out to our outer lifestyle. Interestingly enough, whenever the Bible talks about modesty, it is almost always in the context of behavioral conduct of a godly lifestyle. Very little of it addresses how to dress, although that is still somewhat important.  1 Peter 3:3-4 for example, talks about how true beauty doesn't consist of outward appearances but by a gentle and quiet spirit. Modesty is ultimately about having a humble heart before God and dress code is only a small part of it.

 

There are some problems with the modesty issue in the church today. First, it is usually reduced to an issue of clothing and it is always exclusivity a women's issue. Both men and women are called to have a modest spirit and men should also dress modestly as well. I can't tell you how disgusted I am seeing guys post shirtless pics from the bathroom online or walking around with baggy pants sagging on their butts. The worst offense of them all in my opinion is guys wearing skinny jeans. We all know that is equally sinful as murder. Who on earth decided it was fashionable or good for reproduction for men to wear his girlfriend's jeans? Nobody wants to see his big (or small) bulge in public. I'm sure God would facepalm himself at that. smh. 

 

Yes we should dress appropriately in a way that reflects our modesty. But the problem is sometimes we become legalistic about it. The trivial questions always come up. Is strapless shirts okay or not? Is this skirt showing too much leg? Ultimately these questions don't really mean much because what is modest is different depending on culture and occasion. You also cannot have every base covered (pun intended). You may have your breasts, butt and legs covered, but what about guys who have foot fetishes and you're wearing flip flops? Or what about guys who dress sharp but are showing huge biceps that cause women who love muscles to lust? The point is, you could completely covered like a Muslim woman and still people could lust after you. What is ultimately important is do you have a godly mindset? If you do, then you will naturally make an effort to dress modestly in your own way. That is all you can do. 

 

Thank you Invincible for this great post. :)  I couldn't agree more. About Ringers statement I believe I didn't take the time to read between the lines and I'm not yet used to his style on the forum(aka ironic, questioning etc.).The reason why I posted this video, although I agree it is exagerating at some points, is because I don't see christians interested in this subject at all. And a thing that is not only specific to this but in general is that I don't see a big difference between christians and non-christians today, and this makes me raise questions. Christians are supposed to be in the world but not of the world, so they should somehow stand out and set an example(and I don't mean only clothes here but actions more). At least this is how I see things. But coming back on topic, maybe the reason I shouldn't expect it to be so discussed is because, just like you said in the ending, it comes down to ones own personal walk of faith and no one should be allowed to restrict or judge as long as ones personal conscience is clear about it.

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What Invincible said is correct.

I was posting something that I've seen feminists state, kind of as a bug spray.

 

Anyway, I do believe modest dress is the best dress. Sorry if I came off the wrong way.

Hey Ringer, no problem really. :)  Sorry also to jump up too fast to conclusions. I'll have to come more often on the forums and learn about you guys better before responding on first impulse. Thanks for being the first to open the discussion though, I really appreciate it.

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I'm a Christian, and I have a lot of thoughts on this subject, but I'll try to keep this brief. I watched the first 10 or so minutes of the video and found it difficult to stomach in places, especially when teenage boys are presented as experts about how men behave and how women should behave.

I always get uncomfortable when we Christians discuss modesty. As Invincible said, the conversation tends to revolve around women's behavior. We seem to blame women for what they cannot control (the sexual attraction of men) and fail to hold men accountable for what they can control.

I know that our clothing can reflect our spiritual condition (much like our spiritual condition is reflected in our finances, our attitude to work, our friendships, our leisure and hobbies, etc.). I know that the Christian life is lived in community and that we are called to love, support, and encourage each other. But this is one issue where I believe that our teaching has placed an unfair burden of shame on women.

I'll also admit to some conflicted feelings on this topic. I don't mean to imply that I believe modesty is unimportant or that I have no respect for the perspectives presented in the video. Nor would I ever want to offend any of you other posters. I humbly submit my misgivings to a community I value.

Thank you Skylark for sharing your opinion with us. I somehow agree with you. Especially on the inverted accountability which is a product of this fallen world, in which basically everything seems to be inside out. I was thinking about what you said about the teenage boys presented as experts. I don't think they were meant to be presented as such but thinking about it now, it is curious to me and makes me think why they chose to interview so many young boys and not more mature men (also available for women). Anyway, you didn't offend anyone, at least no offense taken from me. :) Yes modesty is important, at least for a christian, but I emphasize like in the beginning that it starts in the heart, and I'm thanking you guys and this discussion that started, for making it even clearer.

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And a thing that is not only specific to this but in general is that I don't see a big difference between christians and non-christians today, and this makes me raise questions. 

 

So true! Sometimes I have to watch my thinking when I see professed christians looking like hedonistic worldlings...they might have a lovely relationship with God. Apart from modest v immodest dress, I think part of it is that christians don't have a unique dress code that makes them identifiable as for instance religious Jewish clothing. 

 

 

The worst offense of them all in my opinion is guys wearing skinny jeans. We all know that is equally sinful as murder. Who on earth decided it was fashionable or good for reproduction for men to wear his girlfriend's jeans? 

 

Amen!! Though I'm not sure where I would rank it against saggy-panted crack exposure... Skinny jeans are even worse when those men are middle-aged. Nothing cool about older people trying to act "hip"....

 

As Invincible mentioned, modesty is mostly framed as a women's issue but being male I am really interested in hearing what people consider to be some male standards of modest dress. Be legalistic if you like.

 

Shorts above the knee?

Being shirtless amongst friends & family (ie not public); on the beach/swimming?  

I'm guessing speedos *shivers* are out....

What about sleeveless shirts? or those (daggy) muscle shirts with arm holes so big they could accommodate both of the Hulk's thighs?

What about those covering but tight muscle shirts/compression wear? Pokies (nipples showing through clothing)?

Anything that allows for a plummer's crack to appear would be out. However, some underwear stretches above the pants-top and can be exposed by bending or stretching. Would you consider it immodest to get a flash of that? (not talking about the sagging pants where the undies are pretty much doing most of the butt-covering). I could see how some people might have issue with a female exposing some lacy lingerie looking underwear...

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