Invincible

The Death Penalty

46 posts in this topic

My rationale does not relate to the death of the guilty party. It relates to the measurable fact that people have been executed and been innocent. Because of this there is always a chance that the wrong person can be sentenced to death, such as the Steven Truscot case in Ontario, Canada. 

 

Furthermore, I believe unless you have a law degree you can only interpret how laws should be applied.  

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Justice is about paying a debt to society, but no debt can be paid by killing the criminal. Kill the criminal to help the family with their grief? That makes me upset, hoping for death for another in the wake of their after math.

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It really depends on how you define paying the debt. Was the crime so bad that the only real debt that person can pay to society is his life? In my book there are crimes that would fit that mold. It isn't about killing the person to help somebody else out with their grief. It isn't like these families sit around saying I hope this person gets death for what they did. No they say they hope this person pays for what he did, whether that be sitting in prison for x amount of years or the death penalty. People hope for justice for their family, not that somebody else is killed. As for the whole innocents could be put on death row such as Steven Truscot. First that happened in 1959 and most legal and forensic systems have come a long way since then. Second, that is why there is a lengthy appeals process. Somebody cannot be put to death until absolutely every appeal option has been exhausted, and every piece of evidence has been thoroughly examined. Can somebody still be innocent and put death, it's possible, but very unlikely. If there is even a single piece of evidence that could question their guilt then the whole case will be re-examined in the appeals process.

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@Jenny-Litigation is extremely expensive. Plus, they will probably spend many, many years on death row, which takes away from some of the money you would think you would save by them not having to be fed, cleaned, ect....

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I can see both sides and for a long time I was torn. Fiscally I don't think it makes sense to keep a person in prison for life, but I realized that morally I don't believe in the death penalty. Many people receive the death penalty for crimes like murder, yet in the United States someone administers lethal injection to kill them. It always bothered me that the one who performs the lethal injection technically kills the one convicted of a crime but that's not seen as wrong.

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can someone explain to me how killing the criminal is more expensive then supporting him for his whole life in prison? I think the victims family should be able to decide what they want to do to the criminal , eye for an eye....I think the life in prison sentence is the stupidest thing ever becuase they support the criminals in living more than they support say...the homeless?

 

 

 

Why do they sterilize the lethal injection needles?

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As Mahatma Gandhi said, an eye for an eye makes the whole world go blind.

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@MerelyARumor-Like I said before, it's the cost of litigation. Plus, people are on death row for years, so tax dollars are supporting them anyway.

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need someone like Dexter or batman

Dexter would be perfect. Remember that Batman didn't kill...the joker always messed with him because of it.  :P

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Im sorry but Im all for it maybe I dont have a heart and maybe Im over the top...but I think in our society those that do harm should be elminated, those who feel bad about...simply look away, this is life there is good and evil. Some people are evil and sick they cannot help it, its who they are.  We need to stop wasting time "trying and hoping they will change" too many sad situations happen because things arent taken seriously.  No killing unless absolutely necessary? when is it necessary then? how many more people need to be murdered? Unfortunately below is a prime example of why things shouldnt be overlooked, they knew this person was a mentally unstable adolescent and violent yet he was continuously released? 

 

*warning severly dark and devastating viewer discretion is advised*

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2285974/Tanya-Byrd-murder-Son-Bahsid-McLean-dissected-mom-sprinkled-body-parts-Bronx-tells-court-dying-trying-HELP.html

 

Also because someone was wrongly accused and killed thats the reason why there should be no death penalty? we might as well say no more long prison sentences because of the wrongfully accused when will we learn that in life there will always be mistakes.  Not trying to be cold hearted but no matter what in life someone will always die for the wrong reason you simply learn from that mistake it wasnt the fault of the death penalty it was the idiot who put them in prison in the first place when the law/cops actually do their job right incidents like this will be less likely to happen

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If I had to pick one reason the death penalty shouldn't be around it would be because of the death of an innocent. I would let every killer and rapist run free before I condemned an innocent person, it doesn't matter that innocent people die all the time, it matters that when we have the power to preserve a life we should.

And it's not that someone acted stupidly to let them end up in jail, it's called being in the wrong place at the wrong time.

How would you feel walking into your house and finding your whole family had been chopped up into little pieces only to have the law blame you, and put you on trial for death?

Every man is created equal, every one has the right to live, the unalienable right to life as our fore fathers had said themselves. We do not have the right to take a life regardless of what crimes they committed. You're pro death penalty but anti abortion, so what makes one of those lives so much better than the other?

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Honestly Im probly not the best person to ask this question because if its my time to go its my time...we all die not to sound depressing but I will go with your analogy for a moment.  If I was wrongfully accused and sent to be put to death then there would be another story of a woman who was wrongfully accused which would hopefully bring attention to the flaws of the judicial system because truly thats where the problem lies...btw the death penalty would probly be the "easy way out" prison life is no joke.

 

Lets say we take away the death penalty then, ben who is wrongfully accused gets life in prison...only to be murdered by Inmate #265 convicted murder/rapist(who shouldve been executed)...now maybe his life was a little longer since there was no death penalty.  But yet again a story will come out about a man named Ben who was wrongfully accused and murdered which will make heads turn yet again to the judicial system... Who is originally responsible for this sitiation.

I never said anyones life was better I just understand people live and people die...and there is always a reason, even people who live after being released from wrongfully accused find it difficult to start a new life. They get no compansation for their sufferings, the judicial system is simply jacked and needs to be reevaluated also there are too many lazy cops thats my overall point.

abortion is a different topic but I think you understand that lol since you support abortion but are against the death penalty.

 

Overall no matter what anyone says I will still be all for killing those monsters when it comes to people like that Im cold blooded, my sister asked me a question kinda related to this about the walking dead if she or someone else close to me turned would I be able to shoot them. My answer? yes without hesitation because their soul is gone and they are only out for blood...thats how I view those things behind bars. 

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I'm one of the 'on the fence' ones. I agree that the justice system is, by no means, perfect, and that there are some innocent people who get imprisoned. Where I'm on the fence is this. It should only be used in the most heinous of crimes, and if the evidence is irrefutable (which we have the ability to do now, the problem is that officials and uniforms are rarely given enough time to go above and beyond because 'the people want answers and they want them NOW'). If the system could be adjusted so that 'life in prison' actually meant that they HAD to live out their days in maximum security (considering the situation is one of massive evidence), with the security guards being the best of the best... or, better yet, let the security guards be psychologically ok'd ex-military (or make it a military position, even), as a possible solution... then, I'd be all for them living. If they lose all of the 'privileges'. Basic human rights is all they should get. Does someone who has raped, or murdered, another person need to have the right to marry? Do they need to have cable tv, and other such niceties? No. However, and I could be completely wrong here because I don't have a lot of knowledge on the justice system, my understanding is that any prisoner has so many appeals... but after that, if any lawyer, or justice group, goes over their case and thinks they can help keep them off of death row, they then have EVEN MORE chance to get freed. Also, some of these psychopaths and, even worse, sociopaths, are so very good at 'acting' a part. If they have killed repeatedly, raped repeatedly, or other such heinous acts, then if they DID happen to get out, who knows how many people would be in danger. What if they are a pedophile? A Sociopathic murderer? If our system is so flawed as to mistake some innocent people and punish them for NOT doing something, then who's to say that is not so flawed as to let out a criminal who has learned some new tricks and is able to outsmart anyone? It's amazing the things they can learn from prison... some even get degrees. So, I'm NOT FOR IT (for humanity reasons), but I'm also not completely convinced to be AGAINST it (because if you don't act humanely, why should you be treated humanely).

 

Also, as just one other thought. If we feel that we have a right to defend our family and our home, and that that may mean shooting to kill, then why would it be wrong for a victim to want to see a finality brought to an intruder of their life, or the life of a family member? It's ok for him/her to live (even in prison) as long as they manage to escape from the crime before being caught by our justice?

 

I have never been able to decide if I am for, or against, and I still can't figure it out... because, even though it sounds like I'm arguing FOR, I still have that voice inside that says 'it's not ok to KILL someone'. Just to be clear. I also won't argue my point with anyone, because we are all entitled to a viewpoint. :) This is just mine... and it's a wishy washy one at that.

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I am 100% against the idea. I just don't trust any government enought to give them authority to kill somebody. The legal system is a joke. The police forces oftentimes resemble a gang. Truth is sometimes an inconvience, more oftentimes irrelevant.

 

Take the Duke lacrosse "rape" case for example. They dragged those lacrosse players through the mud, put them through hell, took away their college eduction. The whole case was a lie. The prosecutor knew it was a lie. The woman had made false allegations in the past. But it was an election year for the prosecutor, and he wanted a big case to make a name for himself. They never filed any charges against the woman because they deemed her too crazy. She's now in prison for second degree murder.

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I'm a Texan. Being pro-death penalty kinda comes with the territory there. Harris County, where Houston is located, has executed more people than any other in the country. The #2 county is Dallas County. People are often very proud of that in a way that I find a bit unnerving.

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I'm with Victor Hugo on this one. His book "The Last Day Of A Condemned Man" is worth a read.

 

I have examined the death penalty under each of its two aspects: as a direct action, and as an indirect one. What does it come down to? Nothing but something horrible and useless, nothing but a way of shedding blood that is called a crime when an individual commits it, but is (sadly) called "justice" when society brings it about. Make no mistake, you lawmakers and judges, in the eyes of God as in those of conscience, what is a crime when individuals do it is no less an offense when society commits the deed.

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Crystal... I can totally understand that thought. I also agree with it. I'm still not sure I agree that there aren't a few times when letting someone live, after certain continuous crimes, is ok either. However, thank you for sharing this because it does speak to the part of me that does believe that killing is ok.

 

Everyone here has very good points for being against is 100%.

 

I still have mixed emotions about it and, honestly, I'm not sure I want to feel 100% one way or the other, but that quote is a very eloquent way of stating the against view point. I feel like that's not a decision I want to be the one making. If I WERE to have to make the decision... I would probably go for NO DP, but not because I don't feel that some people deserve it, but because I would be afraid of feeling the sadness of taking a life, and never be able to recover from that sadness. Even though the person I'm saving probably has no regrets and/or remorse for their own actions and, if they got out, would probably do them all over again. Of course, THEN I'd feel even guiltier, because I could have prevented those other deaths/rapes, etc, of innocent children, or anyone else.

 

Edit: does NOT

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I am still against, as I have previously stated.

It violates the 8th amendment, and has been proven not to deter crime.

That, along with it being inhumane.

(Also, incase anyone notices, I did delete a few of my previous comments in this thread due to; what I'll call last years ignorance :D)

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