Alex

Your thoughts on "Reclaimed virginity"

48 posts in this topic

So perhaps the greatest problem of all is that someone would even feel the desire to call themselves a "reclaimed virgin". Since non-virgins and virgins are equally precious, why even use this term?

 

Very true. Labels like "virgin," and "non-virgin" only cause shame for being one or the other, or causes pressure to have sex or avoid having sex. In these modern days, virginity, or a lack of virginity, is a huge part of someone's identity. That's very unfortunate, and it just results in virgin-shaming and slut-shaming. But seeing as the word "virgin" has been around since the bible, I doubt these terms will ever go away.

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"But even if a non-virgin does drop the "reclaimed" or "born-again" and just call themselves a virgin, why is that really any of our business? Unless we are in a romantic relationship with someone, their virginity should not be our concern."~WanderingWashingtonian

 

While it's none of our business, that doesn't preclude people from having an opinion on it. Some people just find that the term "reclaimed virgin" lacks integrity. And it's human nature for people to call something out when they see it as lacking integrity. And this is actually a positive thing within society.

 

Me personally? I don't care if someone uses the term "reclaimed virgin". If that makes them happy, more power to them. However, I also don't have a problem with people not liking this term for the reason I already cited above. Furthermore, I think the term lacks credibility because you can't reclaim what can't be regained. So.... if anything... I don't know if people even take the term seriously which is why I think it'd be best for another term/phrase to take its place. Since it's a huge, and noble thing to wait till marriage after having had sex, another term/phrase that people would take more seriously, to me, would be the ideal. Why use a term that's scoffed at?

 

"A lot of virgin waiters, like the workers who started their efforts early in the morning, can't stand to see non-virgins, like the workers who started their work at the end of the day, getting the same reward as them. The virgins have been waiting since the beginning, but the non-virgins only just recently started; it doesn't seem fair for them to be treated the same."~WanderingWashingtonian

 

Same reward? What reward do you speak of because that's a vague statement. I don't see any evidence of non-virgins not being treated the same as virgins. Just because people have issue with the term "reclaimed-virgin" doesn't mean they are being unkind or unsupportive towards non-virgins.

 

"But many people unfortunately think of their virginity less as a gift and a blessing, and more as a point of pride, as something that makes them morally superior to everyone who has had sex. We must guard ourselves against this kind of thinking, for it breeds arrogance."~WanderingWashingtonian

 

Really? I personally haven't gotten that impression. And certainly not on this forum. This does bring up a subject though. On this forum and outside of it I've seen people bash others because they are unwilling to date or marry a non-virgin. That thing has got to stop. It's pure hypocrisy and it's inconsiderate. Because the very people who want to sit on their high horse and tell you what preferences you should and shouldn't have are the very same people who will not date someone because they are of a different religion. They are the very same people who will not date someone because they are not attracted to them. They are the very same people who will not date someone because the prospect is 5 inches shorter than them. If you're going to tell someone what preferences they should or shouldn't have, then the only way for you not to be labeled a hypocrite, is for you to have no preferences yourself. And though it really shouldn't have to be said... I will because some people don't seem to get it:

 

You don't know what's best for other people. They know what's best and right for them. And you know what's best and right for you. 

 

"I should hate to think that this community, usually so supportive, would make non-virgins feel unwelcome when they share our common goal of celibacy."~WanderingWashingtonian

 

I seek clarity and objectivity in my assessment. And from what I see the majority of what I've seen on this forum is unwavering  support. Let me provide some examples from this thread alone:

 

"This is just personal preference. No matter what each person decides to call themselves I applaud them for making this commitment and sticking to it." ~Alex

 

"I strongly admire those who choose to stop having sex and abstain until marriage, I just don't like the "reclaiming virginity" and "born again virgin" terms."~Sophie

 

"Although I respect those who are waiting despite not having waited in the past, because it's a very hard thing to stop once you have started, doing so does not make you a "reclaimed virgin", it makes you a non-virgin who is now waiting."~LookingForTheOne

 

"Ahhh this! Yeah, I'm not okay with the term "reclaimed virgin." I give the utmost respect to these people, though, because I can't even imagine how difficult it has to be to stop having sex/sexual relations when you've already experienced it and know how awesome it is."~Ace

 

What I've seen from the above is a strong, unwavering support for those who are not virgins but are now committed to waiting until marriage. Nothing... absolutely nothing wrong with people having issues with certain terminology. As I said earlier, it's human nature to call out what they see as lacking integrity.

 

"We do NOT have to use these terms due to the controversy presented, but these are the definitions.

 

(One can not literally reclaim virginity, but I once thought that was too obvious to state.)"~Stacie

 

Yes, it's obvious to most. But I can envision a circumstance of a young girl putting less value on virginity if she rationalizes that it can be reclaimed. Maybe I'm wrong here, but it's certainly worth contemplating.

 

Alex wrote:

 

"I also think that it gives off the notion to others that it is okay to have sex, you can reclaim your virginity. I've noticed that some of my friends have started to think in this context, give it a try to see what you missing, then reclaim." 

 

I think someone else shared similar sentiments as the above. But I've spent enough time on this post. Point is, there does seem to be some evidence for how this term "reclaimed-virginity" could lead to others taking virginity less serious. Words and how we use them do have consequences.

 

To end this.... My personal sentiment is I really could care-less if someone wants to call themselves a "reclaimed-virgin". If that makes them happy, more power to them.

 

However, I'm merely defending those who have a problem with this terminology. I can't see a problem with people having a problem with this terminology or anything that is ultimately fraudulent. People don't like this terminology because it suggests you can get back what can never be retrieved. They have a problem with the fact that the term lacks integrity. Why is that a bad thing? 

 

I'm open to hearing other sides... I have no problem with being wrong about things. But this is how I see it all right now.

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I'm open to hearing other sides... I have no problem with being wrong about things. But this is how I see it all right now.

 

I agree with what you said. I have never seen any evidence on this forum that virgin waiters don't think non-virgin waiters are as good as they are. I usually see stuff along the lines of, "good for you! I'm glad you've made this decision. Good luck." I'm read all the comments on this thread and I don't see anything that disrespects "reclaimed virgins." Whatever negative opinions were spoken here were merely about the term reclaimed virgin. Not the actual people themselves. I think some people just misunderstood, or didn't read all those supportive quotes that you found.

 

The fact of the matter is, there are a lot of controversial things discussed on this forum. One of them being that a small majority of people here will only marry a virgin, no exceptions, and an equal (possibly larger) will only date a non-virgin if they have fully committed to WTM of their own free will and/or strongly regret their sexual past and are more than willing to be celibate until marriage. Or no one is willing to date or marry outside of their religion. Or some guys will insist on their wife changing her last name (now this was hard for me to swallow.) Yeah, there's a lot of controversy here, but that's what happens on all forums. I find that this is a way more positive environment than the vast majority of forums I have chatted on. Difference of opinion can't be avoided. But as I said earlier, I saw no evidence of anyone looking down on non-virgin waiters. I've never seen that on this forum ever. Nor have I seen people bashing non-virgins who aren't waiting.  

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I'll be honest here and say I prefer the term of "Now Waiting" or "Secondary purity". "Born-again virgin" has been an interesting term to me, but I do see where they're coming from on that. Even if I wasn't a virgin but decided to WTM, I wouldn't use that term, just doesn't seem like it would be relevant to me. But whenever people do use it, I think more on the decision they made rather than whatever they call themselves.

Also, I don't think anyone was particularly in wrong judgement of non-virgins who are now WTM. They were merely answering the question.

As far as everyone being equal here, we're all WTM, whether you're a virgin or not. THAT to me is worthy of all the support and encouragement we can give each other. And yes, there will be times when we will all disagree, it's apart of our human nature. The thing about this particular scenario about "titles" of non-virgins, is to not let someone else's opinion change the way you think of yourself. A virgin in no way is "holier than thou", we all have our flaws that we regret. Also, when expressing your opinion, you also must present it in a respectful, mature manner. If someone doesn't agree with you, stand up for what you believe, but also let them express their opinion, and respectfully disagree if it comes to that.

So you all that once didn't WTM, but now are, please don't take things too personally. Cuz YOU made the desicsion to WTM, therefore feel free to express yourselves how you want. Also respect that not everyone will agree, and that's okay cuz you know who you are, and who you're Waiting for, and that's what truely matters.

As for you all who have always been WTM, be respectful in expressing your opinions, and continue to support and encourage everyone who is now WTM. No matter how they got to this point of Waiting. And remember why we're all here, that is our most uniting and common goal that not many can share.

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I've never really thought about the terminology before.  I have, however, thought about the subject -- a lot -- throughout my life.  Into my early thirties I was determined to marry only a virgin.  I was immovable on that.  Whether modern society wants to admit it or not, there is immense pain and heartbreak when  a spouse has given the gift of their virginity away to someone else.  God began working on my heart though and for the past two to three years my opinion in the matter has changed.

There are a couple of major factors that have influenced the way I presently view virginity.  One is my relationship with God.  In that relationship, despite the things I have done over the course of my life, when I come to God I am clean, pure, flawless and without sin.  I am treasured, loved, and adored as someone who has never dirtied or defiled himself in any way.  For all intents and purposes I am no longer a sinner when I am in God's presence because of his grace, because of the power of his love for me, and because of His sacrifice at the cross.  I am a spritual "virgin."  I've always viewed my relationship with God as a spiritual marriage so, I think the terminology applies.

The other main influence on the way I view virginity is the story of a woman that I heard on the radio when I was growing up.  The woman had been raped and used more times than she could remember.  She was deeply wounded and carried an imense amount of shame.  She did not consider herself a virgin and most of society didn't, "technically," consider her one either.

At some point she got married and she simply could not have sex with her husband.  She tried, they both tried -- year after year, attempt after attempt.  She wanted to give that gift to her husband, she wanted to share that beauty and intimacy with him but, was simply unable.  Her emotions and her heart would just close down and there was no connection or intimacy shared.

Her husband was kind, patient, gentle, nurturing, and endlessly worked to heal her.  One night, about eight years into their marriage they tried yet again and, for the first time she surrenderd herself to her husband -- heart, spirit, and body.  He knew instantly and whispered into her ear as he held her tightly, "there's my virgin.  There she is.  There is my beautiful virgin."

When she heard this she wept tears of pure joy and relief because for the first time in her life she was clean, and whole, and pure, and undefiled and knew it in her heart.

That is the kind of power God formed into marriage.  In my opinion, a husband has the power to completely restore the virginity of the woman he is married to, so long as she surrenders her sexual past to him.  I think it is this way because marriage is so holy and pure that it requires a continual state of virginity or, sexual and emotional exclusivity in order to flourish.  The only way you can truly achieve that is if all prior sexual bonds are broken.

When it comes to virginity, there are exactly three parties in an adult's life that have any concern in the matter -- the person in question, God, and their spouse/potential spouse.  Apart from those three parties it's no one else's business or concern.  If those three parties consider the person a virgin, who is to say that they are not?

I think that God's forgivness is so powerful that it's completely legitimate for a person to say, "I've had sex before but, God restored my virginity and my purity to me."  In stating that, they aren't being dishonest about their sexual past but are making it clear that they are worthy of being as cherished, as loved, and as respected as someone who has not had sex.  They are making it known that they have a foundation of purity upon which to build a romantic relationship.

Something to take note of is, there are plenty of people who have had sex but, have since gone longer without it than most virgins.  That's just something to think about.

My suspicion is that my future wife will likely not be a virgin.  The liklihood of me being married to one diminishes with each passing year.  It does not really matter to me anymore though. In my eyes, and my heart, and in my bed my wife, no matter her past, gets to be a virgin.  She gets to be pure and flawless to her husband.  I will make sure she knows every day of her life that, as far as I'm concerned, she is a virgin and has never been with another, so long as she surrenders that to me.  That will be my right, my authority, my glory, and -- above all -- my duty as a husband to give that gift to her.  Without having that foundation of purity and cleanliness to build on, a marriage is greviously hindered.

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@ BigMat - AMEN, Brother!   ... Look I got nothing to add to what Big Mat said but since this is a subject of terms (i.e. born-again..reclaimed...virgin..non-virgin...waiter..etc.) I felt I should mention this. I once dated a girl who had been physically abused as a child by one of her parents. I won't get into much detail beyond that since it isn't my story to tell; however she did come full circle to the point of moving back in with and forgiving the parent that had abused her, as part of her walk with Christ. When she described being loved and how she saw herself now she rightfully described herself as being "Gods' Princess worthy of a prince." I think if we laid down our pride in terms and titles and tried to see things thru Christs' perspective then we would feel the same way. So I will agree with her and Big Mat and the only term I will use to describe the woman I love is 'Gods' Princess.'

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I mean, sorry for everyone who's offended, but I'm just being practical. I'd apply the same standard to myself. If you have been into space once, then you're an astronaut. You can't undo it, take it back, decide to wait a while and then go back like it's the first time. There's a lot of firsts that people count special in the world. Presidents throw out first pitches. We bash wine bottles on inaugural voyages of ships. Businesses frame their first dollar. Two nations competed crazily to put the first man in space.

 

You can't take those things back. Crossing the threshold is crossing the threshold. Time is fixed.

 

I think the mistake is hearing these things as a measure of condescension or rivalry. Purely from a taxonomy point of view, if you've had sex...you ain't no virgin. That may seem offensive, but I don't think it's intended to be, and furthermore, consider the reaction to telling someone who has kept pure that they're no better/better off than someone who didn't and then changed their mind.

 

Reclaiming the spirit of abstinence, waiting, saving, etc. is fantastic, and WTM is why we're all here. I'm certain we can all focus on that as our unifying theme. 

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Lonely Knight, your example of the ship on its maiden voyage made me raise an eyebrow for it to be used for this particular analogy.  While "she" is Christened on that first trip out, if she is sold or given to someone else, "she" will be new to that person who will most likely Christen "her" again.  Of course that's using the "its new to me" analogy.  Not to say I disagree with your statement, in a lot of ways, but that sometimes a better comparison could be used.

 

Also, I only refer to the ship/boat as "she/her" because those are the commonly used nouns to refer to ships/boats, no other reason.

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True, but 1) that will only be the ship's maiden voyage for the new owner, not the ship and 2) the ship was but one of several analogies. :)

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Alright, correct me if I'm wrong, but nobody has said those of us who are virgins are better than those who aren't, we were simply answering the question honestly! To be honest, I know for me personally, it would be even harder to wait for marriage if i wasn't a virgin and I greatly admire those who stop having sex to wait for marriage. That doesn't mean, however, that those members are virgins. I'm sorry if I've offended anyone by what I've said, but I stand by it.

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I guess it is because I'm atheist, but the way I see it once you lose your virginity you have lost it. You may choose to change your behavior and live a chaste life from now, and that'll be a bonus for you in my book. However, your current behavior doesn't change the fact that you had sex in the past.

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@WanderingWashington.....So very well put! I happen to have a very good friend in my life that is Christian & she is celibate, she frankly admits it is very difficult at times, when the sexual feelings arise, but with God she is able to maintain her celibacy. I on the other hand i'm 43 & a virgin...It doesn't make me any better than her, I just made a different choice & avoided the issues she has. But yet I have struggles as well in staying true to my commitment, that God has that husband out their for me..Honestly, I'm not to fond of the term though....Being honest & transparent about who you are is more proactive to those you wish to influence.

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Hmmmmmm AGarden your comments made me read Washingtons post again and yep im with you and WW good call especially first cpl of paragraphs. Fab xx

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They're just such strange terms to use to me. If you've had sex you're not a virgin and you can't get your virginity back. I know there is the response "Well, they're not saying they're literally virgins again." But, to me, that just makes it all the more strange to use those terms. "Reclaim" means to take something back. Virginity can't be taken back. So, why use such a strange term to desribe a non-virgin who is now waiting until marriage? "Born Again Virgin" maybe makes a little more sense, since you're saying your old self is dead, but it still is strange to me. I mean, you're still you. Maybe you've had a personality change or have developed a new belief (the belief in waiting until marriage), but that doesn't change the fact that you're still, in actuality, the same person. You have still had sex. When you have sex again you won't be losing you're virginity again. I mean, a new person (a virgin) was not actually born.

 

At the end of the day, though, it really isn't a big deal if they use either of these terms even if they don't really make sense to me so long as the person still has the understanding that they are not actually a virgin. And even then, if someone believes that it's not like it will really affect my life in any way. It would only be an issue if I'm dating someone and they simply say they're a virgin even if they really aren't. In that case, it would be far better for me if they say "Reclaimed Virgin" or "Born Again Virgin" since even if I don't agree with the terms I'll know they aren't actually virgins.

 

To touch on another topic, I want to discuss the sentiment that there is tension growing between virgins and non-virgins on the forum. I hope no one feels that my wanting to marry only a virgin qualifies as treating non-virgins poorly. People are allowed to have preferences and dealbreakers. I mean, someone might not want to date me because they are unattracted to me. That does not mean they have treated me poorly. It just means they had no interest in being with me. Similarly, my having no interest in being with a non-virgin is not the same as treating non-virgins poorly.

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To touch on another topic, I want to discuss the sentiment that there is tension growing between virgins and non-virgins on the forum. I hope no one feels that my wanting to marry only a virgin qualifies as treating non-virgins poorly. People are allowed to have preferences and dealbreakers. I mean, someone might not want to date me because they are unattracted to me. That does not mean they have treated me poorly. It just means they had no interest in being with me. Similarly, my having no interest in being with a non-virgin is not the same as treating non-virgins poorly.

 

I really don't think there is "tension growing" between virgins and non-virgins on this forum. On this thread there was some, but I haven't seen any anywhere else. Maybe I'm just missing it? And you're right, people are allowed to have preferences. You are far from the only person on this site who will only marry a virgin. The majority here want to either marry a virgin or someone who is now celibate and WTM. I personally don't care, but most here do. You are definitely not alone in that. I think it is understandable if a non-virgin, waiter or not, was a bit offended to hear you will only marry a virgin, but that is your choice to make and like you said, you are not treating anyone poorly.

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I really don't think there is "tension growing" between virgins and non-virgins on this forum. On this thread there was some, but I haven't seen any anywhere else. Maybe I'm just missing it? And you're right, people are allowed to have preferences. You are far from the only person on this site who will only marry a virgin. The majority here want to either marry a virgin or someone who is now celibate and WTM. I personally don't care, but most here do. You are definitely not alone in that. I think it is understandable if a non-virgin, waiter or not, was a bit offended to hear you will only marry a virgin, but that is your choice to make and like you said, you are not treating anyone poorly.

I'm not entirely sure if there is tension growing either, but I have seen that sentiment (or at least a similar one) expressed.

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 I think it is understandable if a non-virgin, waiter or not, was a bit offended to hear you will only marry a virgin, but that is your choice to make and like you said, you are not treating anyone poorly.

 

One thing that I think is important to keep in mind is that preferences aren't always conscious choices and perhaps most of the time they aren't. Some people seem to act like having the deal-breaker that you'll only marry a virgin is some kind of scheme that was formulated. Speaking for myself I will say it's not a conscious choice and it means a great deal to me. In theory I could go against my nature... my true self, and marry a non-virgin but then I wouldn't be happy. And what good would be created by that? Instead, it's my belief, that it's absolutely vital that people be true to themselves for they are the ones that will have to live with their decisions... not others who will criticize or applaud those decisions.

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Good point Alex!!

 

I agree celibate would be the correct term. It doesn't make the person any less of a person but I would not go as far as saying I am a virgin again if I ever lost my virginity. lol silly

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Good point Alex!!

 

I agree celibate would be the correct term. It doesn't make the person any less of a person but I would not go as far as saying I am a virgin again if I ever lost my virginity. lol silly

 

"celibate" technically is the right term. Calling yourself celibate usually implies that you are not a virgin, but you have now decided to abstain from sex. Cuz you can't abstain from sex if you've never had it! Well I guess that's up for debate, but I never thought of the word celibate applying to virgins. Like a person who has never drunk alcohol would never say "I am sober."

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Words do have nuances... particularly in the English language. But there's a difference between discussing words and their nuances and discussing words being used in a completely inaccurate way. It's for that reason I don't see any irony. But that's just my opinion.

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Celibate is more of a lifelong commitment; I think chastity is the word we're looking for?

 

A simple look through the dictionary would probably solve this. But I always thought 'abstinent' was the right word. And by the way, not all virgins are abstinent, right? That is, they are not all abstaining from sex--some just haven't had the opportunity yet. So you can be a virgin who isn't abstinent and a non-virgin who is. That's how I see it now anyways.

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